Next-Gen Video Game Consoles. DEBATE!

[Takeru]

I haven't seen any debates on this forum about the seventh and newest generation of video game consoles yet, so I wanted to make one. I'll start off with my own little missive.

The seventh generation of consoles has created some of the biggest debates and controversies in video game history. Three experienced hardware developers have drawn their hands from the deck: Microsoft, Sony, and Nintendo. Claiming that their consoles have power, interactivity, and innovation deemed impossible even beyond our wildest imaginations, each vie for the loyalties of the many gamers that seek to reinvent their gaming experience.

Microsoft, software developer famous for its critically acclaimed Windows series of operating systems, was the first to release their system, the Xbox 360, on November 22, 2005. Its next-generation graphics, fluid interface, and impeccable online functionality have attracted many gamers, and its one-year head start has given it an insane advantage above the competition. It is the newest, youngest, least experienced console hardware developer, having only made one previous console before, the original Xbox, back during the turn of the century. However, years of experience with the inner workings of software functionality have made it a powerful competitor in the fight for next-generation dominance.

Sony, hardware developer that has traveled across many media formats including TV's, portable DVD players, and home theater technology, released their PLAYSTATION 3 one year later on November 17, 2006. Sony has made countless claims towards the greatness of their new system, which has been proven to be the most powerful of all three consoles. Packing groundbreaking technology that strives to bring the best-looking, most theatrical experience to your home entertainment system, the PLAYSTATION 3 is all about power, with added bonuses. The PLAYSTATION Network is all about bringing Sony's fans together, while the new Sixaxis controller aspires to let players play their games in new, interesting ways.

Nintendo, often touted as the oldest, most experienced video game developer and housing some of the most brilliant minds of the gaming industry, threw their new weapon into the fray on November 19, 2006: the quirky Wii. Simple in design, yet ambitious in practicality, Nintendo appeals not only to seasoned veterans of the gaming world, but everyday consumers, people who haven't even set a single foot into gaming. The Wii has introduced its revolutionary new control system, with which Nintendo plans to overturn the gaming world on its head, with innovative motion-sensing capabilities and incredible ease of use. WiiConnect24, a service that remains online even though your console is off, lets you access your friends' worlds even after they've retired, and its range of family-friendly games plan to capture the hearts of day-to-day consumers everywhere.

These three consoles vie for power, and each day new features and games are introduced that change public opinion entirely. They vie for our attention and our loyalty. As the consumers, it is in our power as a collective party to decide whether or not any of these consoles will succeed or fail.

Where do your loyalties stand?

Remember, this is a constructive discussion for sharing and, if necessary, debating opinions. That means it is most definitely not a flamethrowing session. Respect your fellow members and their opinions. Any misbehavior will be reported to moderators immediately.

I've been following the seventh generation closely, and I am also the proud owner of all three consoles. So if there are any questions pertaining to the PS3, Wii, or 360, ask, and I will answer. Also, if there are any false claims made about any of the three systems, I will denounce them immediately.

With that said, have at it!

[ricochet]

um..why does the ps3 not play ps2 games?

[D.J.P]

Yes it does. Just the PS3 (first generation) has some problems with its backward-compatibility. I think its on Sony's site a list of games that work (at least to some degree)

Hence why I won't be getting a PS3 for a while. Probably around Christmas time when it should be 2nd generation at least (and the price is like half of what it starting for out here - nearly $1000AU)

Oh and in case you missed it I will be going for the PS3 for just one reason (backwards compability) and until that issue is fully settled, I'll stick with my trusty PS2

[Kuro-puppy]

I'll go for Wii (being Nintendo fan and all) but i'll wait with buying it till i've seen what other gamedevelopers are gonna do with the controller coz from what i've seen sofar, the gamedevelopers beside Nintendo itself are all delevering Wii games with 'questionable' controls >.<

[Takeru]

Yes it does. Just the PS3 (first generation) has some problems with its backward-compatibility. I think its on Sony's site a list of games that work (at least to some degree)

Hence why I won't be getting a PS3 for a while. Probably around Christmas time when it should be 2nd generation at least (and the price is like half of what it starting for out here - nearly $1000AU)

Oh and in case you missed it I will be going for the PS3 for just one reason (backwards compability) and until that issue is fully settled, I'll stick with my trusty PS2

With more and more firmware updates coming in, the BC (Backwards Compatibility) support for PS3's been shaping up. Couple glitches here and there, but the going's good for US and Japanese PS3's (the only pre-gen games I own are the MGS series, the GTA series, Mercenaries, and Bully, so I can't say exactly how well it does on a whole). Unfortunately, European releases of the PS3 will not have the PS2's Emotion Engine chipset like US or Japanese PS3's, which will mean that their backwards compatibility support will be software-emulated. In English, that means that PS3's will have a very limited range of support for playable PS2 and PS1 games. This is almost exactly like the 360, with the sheer exception that Microsoft's backwards compatibility support is a much higher priority to them, but even still, BC support for 360 isn't too good. It seems an even lower priority for Sony, so by the looks of it there'll be very few BC-enabled games in Europe. Bad choice.

Nintendo, on the other hand, is really handling it well compared to the 360 and PS3. The Wii's got flawless GameCube game playback and downloadable N64 and (S)NES games through the virtual console. They're doing a fantastic job of it.

I'll go for Wii (being Nintendo fan and all) but i'll wait with buying it till i've seen what other gamedevelopers are gonna do with the controller coz from what i've seen sofar, the gamedevelopers beside Nintendo itself are all delevering Wii games with 'questionable' controls >.<

You'll be surprised. A lot of third-party publishers have produced pretty nifty games for the Wii so far. For sports fans, Madden NFL 07 is great, interesting control scheme and everything. Excite Truck is just plain fun for racing fans; get the steering wheel addon if you really wanna immerse yourself. I also love Sonic and the Secret Rings; best 3D Sonic game to come out in a while. But I guess the control schemes aren't too innovative there. But that's where The Godfather: Blackhand Edition, which seems to make the best use of the Wii control scheme so far in terms of third-party games. I guess you can't really blame the third-party developers, though. Nintendo knows what they're doing, and they know their hardware better than anyone else, so I guess it's just a given that they're good at adapting to it more than anyone else.

[Kuro-puppy]

You'll be surprised. A lot of third-party publishers have produced pretty nifty games for the Wii so far. For sports fans, Madden NFL 07 is great, interesting control scheme and everything. Excite Truck is just plain fun for racing fans; get the steering wheel addon if you really wanna immerse yourself. I also love Sonic and the Secret Rings; best 3D Sonic game to come out in a while. But I guess the control schemes aren't too innovative there. But that's where The Godfather: Blackhand Edition, which seems to make the best use of the Wii control scheme so far in terms of third-party games. I guess you can't really blame the third-party developers, though. Nintendo knows what they're doing, and they know their hardware better than anyone else, so I guess it's just a given that they're good at adapting to it more than anyone else.

Ohh! they're doing better than i originally read. And i've heard about the new Sonic game and read about it, it's supposed to be best 3D sonic game in a long while (I like sonic games but it's hard to find really good ones v.v). The thing i'm most curious about is the Wii's internet. I've heard it's free, you probably only have to buy the internet equipment or something, because from what i now you can surf on the internet like pc's and download (S)NES games and N64 games (that costs money tough). I hope the internet will be good for challenging other people in games like the new Smash Bros. No more having to travel through the country for strong opponents ^_^

[Takeru]

Haha, so you're one of those SSBM masters, huh. Well, the WiiConnect24 service is free indeed. In fact, both it and the PlayStation Network are free of charge, unlike Xbox Live, which costs money but has a lot more features and better connectivity. And actually, with the Wii, you don't need any extra equipment to get it online. It can connect to any wireless connection in your house, without the hassle of any wires whatsoever. If you have a router, connecting the Wii to the internet is extremely simple. If you don't, the console comes with a wire that lets you connect it to your modem or ethernet hub.

At the moment, however, the WiiConnect24 service doesn't hook you up with random strangers on the internet when you play games, like the PS Network or Xbox Live. You need to exchange something called "friend codes" 9which work a lot like phone numbers) with friends of yours in order to interact with them at all. While it's good at keeping little Susan from meeting up with strange old men across the internet while playing Pokemon, it's not good for hardcore gamers who want to just jump into a game of Madden NFL 07 against an unpredictable adversary.

[Kuro-puppy]

At the moment, however, the WiiConnect24 service doesn't hook you up with random strangers on the internet when you play games, like the PS Network or Xbox Live. You need to exchange something called "friend codes" 9which work a lot like phone numbers) with friends of yours in order to interact with them at all. While it's good at keeping little Susan from meeting up with strange old men across the internet while playing Pokemon, it's not good for hardcore gamers who want to just jump into a game of Madden NFL 07 against an unpredictable adversary.

That was not so smart of Nintendo but you can always gain friend codes through forums and stuff so it's not a total disaster XD

If you're gonna buy an Xbox 360 i would suggesting waiting with that, a week ago there was this broadcast in my country. It seems that when Microsoft installed the DVD part (the part that reads the game discs info) they forgot to install the safety rubbers that the dvd players have. thanks to that the game discs will touch the metallic part and it creates a circular scratch on the game discs destroying the game. This has happened to a few hundred gamers in my country already and the number of complaints are still rising. Microsoft doesn't want to admit they made an error and just say that the gamers don't place the Xbox 360 on a stable enough ground/table/whatever.

It doesn't matter to me tough since i have no interest in Xbox games (most Xbox games are action games, race games, shooter games and i'm not really that fond of those genres) ^^

I am really interested in the PS3 tough, mainly coz of Final Fantasy but also because of DMC4 (I'm a huge fan of the 3rd one!) and the port of Ninja Gaiden with some extra's < - - - - Ninja Gaiden just plain rocks in my opinion but i don't buy a console for just one game, no matter how cool it is so now with PS3 i'm getting a 2nd change at this game ^_^

Haha, so you're one of those SSBM masters, huh.

not really, i fought against a guy that particapates with his team in the SSBM national championship of my country (I met him during a small unofficial tournament a few months ago) and i lost with 3-4 so i still have a long way to go before i have the right to be called SSBM master >.<

[Takeru]

That was not so smart of Nintendo but you can always gain friend codes through forums and stuff so it's not a total disaster XD

True. People have come up with their own solutions to Nintendo's little phone number thing. Nintendo is smart though. Eventually, they'll realize their mistake. And when they do, they'll allow the option to let you meet up with random people and play against them, like you can on the other consoles, alongside the friend code feature, for those who still want to protect their family's privacy.

It seems that when Microsoft installed the DVD part (the part that reads the game discs info) they forgot to install the safety rubbers that the dvd players have. thanks to that the game discs will touch the metallic part and it creates a circular scratch on the game discs destroying the game.

And that's probably one of the Xbox 360's greatest hardware failures. If you move the 360, the CD may be pushed against the metallic reader, causing a huge ring-shaped scratch. It's been a huge controversy, and I myself got that "ring of death" on my Burnout Revenge CD when I accidentally knocked it over while I was vacuuming the house and my sister was playing. Holy crap, it made this insane grinding noise that scared me half to death. See it in action.

But there is and has always has been a label on the front of the 360's disc tray that says clearly not to move the machine while a game is running inside. It's probably common sense in the first place not to move a product with a fast-speed DVD reader when it's running, but people do it anyways, and while it is a hardware failure, Microsoft at least addressed it, and it's also the consumer's fault for not listening to the safety labels. Regardless, just that one problem shouldn't defer you from buying a 360. Just don't move the console while it's on! It's not that hard.

It doesn't matter to me tough since i have no interest in Xbox games (most Xbox games are action games, race games, shooter games and i'm not really that fond of those genres) ^^

Well I'm sure you've heard the news that Hironobu Sakaguchi, the mastermind behind the Final Fantasy series, is creating two RPG's for the 360: one is Blue Dragon, and the other is Lost Odyssey. Joining him is Nobuo Uematsu, who has composed music for the majority of Final Fantasy games. The 360 is gaining much popularity in that field, and Blue Dragon is a highly-rated masterpiece that has already helped to improve sales in Japan. Outside of those FF-esque adventures, there's also Eternal Sonata, Enchanted Arms, Spectral Force, and Phantasy Star Universe, which all have yet to be released (except Phantasy Star Universe, which is okay, but isn't too great).

Besides that, development costs for games on the PS3 have been on the rise; it simply costs way too much money to make a game for the PS3. Some of the PS2's most memorable games were always RPG's, but they were always quaint and cute and not too flashy (Disgaea, La Pucelle, games like that). They fit perfectly on the PS2... but what about the PS3? This is only a theory, but since most RPG's don't rely on million-dollar budgets, most low-profile RPG makers seem to be ready to move over to the Wii, which costs a lot less to develop for. For the most part, people who pay $600 USD to buy a PS3 are looking for incredible graphics and edge-of-your-seat gameplay. RPG's don't categorize into either of those. I'm not saying that they're inferior to action games, in fact I like RPG's more than action games. However, you look at a typical RPG and you see modest presentation values. They don't need to be flashy to be great games. Sometimes, the lack of prettiness is what gives them their own style. Final Fantasy focuses on grandiose and epic adventures, so it's perfectly at home on the PS3, but there are lots of people who just don't have as much money as Square Enix does. Basically, what I'm saying is that the PlayStation brand is starting to lose its momentum as a roleplaying platform, simply because it just costs way too much. In fact, it's starting to take the place of the original Xbox as the hardcore action gaming platform.

I mean... that's what Sony wants! What with all their claims about "4D gaming" and "120 FPS" and all of that nonsense.

[Kuro-puppy]

it made this insane grinding noise that scared me half to death. See it in action.

That was scary indeed >.<

Sometimes, the lack of prettiness is what gives them their own style. Final Fantasy focuses on grandiose

Lack of prettyness gives style.....Skies of Arcadia fits that description pretty well, if i think about that old Dreamcast game getting a remake with supergood graphics the only thing that comes to my mind is "Blegh!" XD

And Wii being the least expensive and easiest to make games for by far should draw lots of gameproducers to Wii. The gamecube was the other way around, the small disk they used for games in contrast to the big CD-rom like disks from Xbox and Ps2....thanks to that the developers had to spend more money for a Gamecube version of their game than for the other console version, and so Gamecube was neglected by lots of third-party developers. Nintendo has really learned from their past mistakes ^_^

Well I'm sure you've heard the news that Hironobu Sakaguchi, the mastermind behind the Final Fantasy series, is creating two RPG's for the 360: one is Blue Dragon, and the other is Lost Odyssey. Joining him is Nobuo Uematsu, who has composed music for the majority of Final Fantasy games. The 360 is gaining much popularity in that field, and Blue Dragon is a highly-rated masterpiece that has already helped to improve sales in Japan. Outside of those FF-esque adventures, there's also Eternal Sonata, Enchanted Arms, Spectral Force, and Phantasy Star Universe, which all have yet to be released (except Phantasy Star Universe, which is okay, but isn't too great).

Yeah, i heard about that some time ago. Xbox drawing big Japanese RPG makers to them to increase their popularity in Japan.

random quote from a magazine:

Xbox 360 spokesman: We're gonna sell 10 times as much 360's in Japan as we did with the Xbox back then.
Random reporter: 10 times zero is still zero.

^ The reporter has a point there. Xbox sales were disaster in Japan.

and the PS3.....they made a lot of promises a few years ago but the PS3 is considered to be the big loser of the last E3 so they have to work extra hard to make up for that.

[monkey]

I've still never played an Xbox 360, Playstation 3, Nintendo Wii or a Nintendo DS.

I thought it was quite funny that when the PS3 got released over here (only just recently) none of the stores around here sold out at all, probably due to the fact it costs far too much money for a machine that does so very little (I'm talking about the lack of games and lack of HD DVDs which all cost £50 (est. $100USD) which is far too much on their own anyway) while the PS3 costs £430 (That would be est. $850USD) albeit it has lowered in price to £400 (est. $790USD) It's still far more extreme than how much the USPS3 cost.

It's been a few years since I last called myself a gamer since my time playing Video Games has been drastically shortened (I'd be lucky if I spend one hour on Video Gaming in a week nowadays) but So far I've not seen many fun games from the 360 and PS3 but obviously since Wii is a party console I've seen lots. Also the Animé Club I attend have set up a Wii tournament before and I've been told it was a lot of fun, so I look forward to attending one of those soon too.

The main reason I bought a PSP was, I admit, to play Final Fantasy Crisis Core & Final Fantasy Tactics but those games are still a long way off on being released so I spend most my PSP playing time on Tekken 5 and Dragonball Z Budokai Tenkaichi. I intend to get a DS soon because of it's such low price and incredible variation of games. The members of the Animé Club I attend I have noticed that virtually all the members have a DS and many Japanese games ranging from musical dance to 2D fighters, all looking to be very fun to play. Not to mention the price of games being only £10 to £30 (est. $20USD to $40USD respectively). The graphics may be lower quality but the quality of gaming seems to be far superior. Although I am yet to judge since I am only going by what I have seen and I have yet to actually play a Nintendo DS. In short, I plan to get a DS soon and a Wii next year.

I've heard aswell that the game play videos that PS3 showed to the public turned out to be incredibly inaccurate with none of their games having anywhere near as good graphics as their demos of the product said they would. Is Sony talking nonsense again or is this false?

I also hear that Sony are planning to release a new smaller powerful PS3, is there any truth to this?

[Takeru]

...far too much money for a machine that does so very little (I'm talking about the lack of games and lack of HD DVDs which all cost £50 (est. $100USD) which is far too much on their own anyway)

Well, HD-DVD is licensed by Microsoft, so I seriously doubt they'd ever come out with a peripheral for playing HD-DVD's on a Sony product like the PS3. However, it does play Blu-Ray DVD's, which can hold more data, but come at a much steeper price (and the built-in Blu-Ray player is half the reason why PS3's are so expensive). The difference is that Microsoft gives players a choice whether they want to install an HD-DVD addon or not, thereby decreasing their price. With PS3's, it comes standard, so you don't have to spend extra on a bulky addon. Problem is, it's there, even if you don't want or need it. But all PS3 games are installed onto Blu-Ray DVDs anyway, so even if you had a choice, it's obvious, since you can't play games on it without the Blu-Ray reader.

while the PS3 costs £430 (That would be est. $850USD) albeit it has lowered in price to £400 (est. $790USD) It's still far more extreme than how much the USPS3 cost.

Not only that, it has fewer features. They got rid of the PS2 Emotion Engine chip from all PS3's being released in Europe, so many popular PS1 and PS2 games can't be played. However, they do have software emulation (similar to the 360 solution), so many of the older games are indeed backwards compatible, with only minor glitches.

The graphics may be lower quality but the quality of gaming seems to be far superior. Although I am yet to judge since I am only going by what I have seen and I have yet to actually play a Nintendo DS. In short, I plan to get a DS soon and a Wii next year.

And that's why both the Wii and the DS are more popular than the PS3 and PSP. There's a bigger variety of deeper, more interesting games. But there are a lot of promising titles in development for PS3, so the tide should shift soon.

I've heard aswell that the game play videos that PS3 showed to the public turned out to be incredibly inaccurate with none of their games having anywhere near as good graphics as their demos of the product said they would. Is Sony talking nonsense again or is this false?

Well, yes and no. Motorstorm was extremely close to being as good-looking as the videos; it looks incredible and runs really smoothly (unlike the demos you see on PS3 booths, which are prerelease and have horrible performance). Unfortunately, it's the only game that came even close to the quality of the CG-rendered teaser trailers.

I also hear that Sony are planning to release a new smaller powerful PS3, is there any truth to this?

Never heard of such a thing being announced. But if it's true, it's likely to be smaller, but definitely not more powerful. Consoles can't change their specs after launch. But the shrink-job happened twice before with both of Sony's previous consoles. The original PlayStation got a PSOne, and the PS2 got the PS2 Slim, so yeah, it's absolutely possible if not guaranteed, but not for a long time (maybe two years or more), and I can assure you there won't be any differences in performance.

UPDATE: Sony is planning to unveil a new PlayStation 3 model which will have a larger hard drive, but no other details have been confirmed. Also of note: Microsoft is also planning to release a new retail model of their 360: the Xbox 360 Elite package. It will have a matte-black finish with matching-colored accessories (unlike the Core and Premium's original white), an HDMI port for clearer high-definition output and 1080p resolution support, and a 120 GB hard drive.

Here's to hoping that the new PS3 model will have a shiny silver finish. =D In other news, time to sell my current 360. XD