The Official Syaoran x Sakura Thread v.02

[Mari]

In love with an imaginary person? What? Lmao!

Non-existent then, since you think Syaoran-kun was never his own person :p

Maybe "lying" was the wrong word, I meant "testing"

Still.  To even have the idea to TEST that theory it would have to be on the knowledge that yes, at one point this shell (as you call it xP)--Syaoran-kun--DID have feelings separate from R!Syaoran.  Or else how would he know to test that particular idea?  Either way R!Syaoran is still supporting the fact that there was “something” separate from him in the clone’s body if he was testing it out.  Really, you're more or less advocating the idea with the "test" that Syaoran-kun lost out to the clone for control of the body.

Which then leads to his must kill reaction could have very well been set off by the fact that the clone won the battle over Syaoran-kun (a separate entity) in who takes the body, if we’re playing that game. xD

And yup he would have defiantly killed C! off because as it turns out R!Syaoran wanted to kill C!Syaoran and then himself so they could be together in the afterlife

Yea.  We’ll just go ahead and file that away into the not agreeing category.  I mean, I understand what you‘re saying.  And from the “logical” point of view it’s probably a nice and comfortable standing--IF you threw out the rest of the series and only aimed on when R!Syaoran appeared.  Because really if you’re backing that then you toss all the evidence that he was forming a heart.  Things like his stand of “I know who I am…I’m Syaoran” and the constant “warmth in his chest” from Sakura.  Not only that but Clow put Sakura up to “melting his heart.”  Even the dreams, again, show separate.

Why else would they go on about the strong heart, and the flame and junk?  Because not only did he have that half heart on “loan” but he was developing his own self as well.  Maybe--just maybe….think back to the dream in Tokyo.  Remember when C!Syaoran said to Syaoran-kun “I’ve been waiting so long…” ?  In the image it looks like he’s coming through a mirror of some sort.  What if Syaoran-kun was imprisoned in his own body, while the clone controlled it?  Much like Syaoran-kun was using it and the Clone had to stay dormant because of the seal?

LMAO.  It’s funny because if you look at what we’re saying (especially my last thought *coughcough*) none of it makes sense…and the more we talk the less sense we make xDD  Chances are nothing is anywhere truly near what we’re talking about but meh…

And I don't know why but I find the way Sakura and Syaoran are standing up in that tube kinda amusing.

Lol.  Yea, them kind of standing in there and waving to us struck me as kind of morbid…actually >.>  It was from an art book, can't remember which.  They also had little sketches of Sakura’s and Syaoran’s rooms…which by the way I found it strange that they have telephones.  Odd.  I never even considered they did.

My theory...? Ummm....using the mirror to get to her...something about that and...because the fact he doesn't seem to be a soul in there...and Yuuko says only souls can....ummm.  Yea. My evidence was gone with that picture so it's sort of pointless to relate concretely ^^;;

Wow, I love it! xD

…I can’t remember but something about him, like his body, being an actual world…or something…? xDD I think it was in the Tsubasa forums…


And yes :3  That phantom of the opera-esque picture is smex~

[redeternity]

Still.  To even have the idea to TEST that theory it would have to be on the knowledge that yes, at one point this shell (as you call it xP)--Syaoran-kun--DID have feelings separate from R!Syaoran.  Or else how would he know to test that particular idea?

Well, he came up with the theory that Syaoran could grow his own heart right from the start when the clone was created. When he gave him the heart he did it in the hope that he would grow his own. Thats where the idea came from. And why would he have to have the knowledge in the first place (that Cloney had grown his own heart) to test this idea? Because then what would be the point of testing it - he'd already know! xD
Lolz *brain dedz*

Having said that though.. There's still so much we don't know yet about R!Syaoran.. Who knows what his real reasons were for all the things he's said/done.

Which then leads to his must kill reaction could have very well been set off by the fact that the clone won the battle over Syaoran-kun (a separate entity) in who takes the body, if we’re playing that game. xD

Yes that is what I believe happened :/ I think.. unless I'm understanding you wrong..

Because really if you’re backing that then you toss all the evidence that he was forming a heart.  Things like his stand of “I know who I am…I’m Syaoran” and the constant “warmth in his chest” from Sakura.  Not only that but Clow put Sakura up to “melting his heart.”

But do all those things really prove that he was growing a heart? Couldn't it have been R!Syaoran's heart that was getting that "warmth" and R!Syaoran's heart that was "melting"? Remember how, in CCS, it took Syaoran a while to warm up to Sakura? But R!Syaoran seems warm from the start.. If it wasn't his heart that was getting that "warmth" and "melting" then why wasn't he rude to Sakura and putting her down and stuff like his CCS counterpart?

Why else would they go on about the strong heart, and the flame and junk?

Because it's R!Syaoran's heart. LOL. Sorry you're probably getting pissed off with me now xD

Remember when C!Syaoran said to Syaoran-kun “I’ve been waiting so long…” ?  In the image it looks like he’s coming through a mirror of some sort.  What if Syaoran-kun was imprisoned in his own body, while the clone controlled it?  Much like Syaoran-kun was using it and the Clone had to stay dormant because of the seal?

Uhh I'm not exactly sure what your argument is here. But, I don't think "Syaoran-kun" or "Our!Syaoran" or whoever was imprisoned inside his own body whilst the Clone controlled it. It was more like Syaoran's true self coming through (a heartless being whose only objective is to collect feathers). The way I see it when the seal was breaking but not fully broken, Syaoran's true self was able to obtain some control over his body.. then it went back to "Our!Syaoran" again.. Then when the seal broke for good the half-heart came out of his body and went back to R!Syaoran.. and from then on "Our!Syaoran" was no longer existant.

Sorry if that wasn't what you were talking about at all and I misinterpreted you completely.

and the more we talk the less sense we make xDD

That is the truest thing that has been said throughout our whole discussion!

Chances are nothing is anywhere truly near what we’re talking about but meh…

Agreed.

…I can’t remember but something about him, like his body, being an actual world…or something…? xDD

o.O Imagine being in FWR... frightening..

Okay, I just thought of something slightly OT but.. How did Fujitaka know to name him Syaoran? Was it "hitsuzen" (probably!)? Or could he (Fujitaka) be working for FWR (probably not!)? Or did Syaoran just have a name tag when Fujitaka found him?

[Mari]

No, no.  I mean he’d have to know that in Syaoran-kun’s heart there was an affection for Sakura separate from himself.  Or else testing that “Sakura is most precious” thing would be pointless.  As in, in order for him to come up with the theory he had to know of a previous affection for Sakura being in Syaoran-kun….

What it comes down to is you like R!Syaoran I like Syaoran-kun so until we know the end we’re going to continue to see what we want.  Agreed? <3

Yes that is what I believe happened

No, it’s not xDD
Because I’m saying that Syaoran-kun’s heart lost out to Clone where you’re saying, from what I’ve gathered from our rather shamefully long discussion, that Syaoran-kun never had a heart to begin with.

Or
….Are you….? *points below*

"Our!Syaoran" was no longer existant.

Caught.
So you DO admit Syaoran-kun had a heart/was seperate?
At the beginning you were saying it was only R!Syaoran’s to begin with but---not anymore…..? =3

If so…then you’re contradicting yourself by saying that---

Because it's R!Syaoran's heart. LOL. Sorry you're probably getting pissed off with me now xD

By the way?
Bad move.
*tackles you to ground* xDD

Yea, see, he has a nice heart *pets it*, but not a strong one.  Strong would have been to defend himself instead of standing there getting pegged by those stones.  What does standing there prove?  It proves that you‘re guilty.  Taking the blame moronically for something you didn‘t do.  Strong would have been being beside Sakura, knowing that (if it‘s what he wants…idk for sure yet) she will never love him but still smiling for her like Syaoran-kun was doing when he knew their relationship was gone.  Strong would have been not starting to say crap about “Are you leaving because of me?” when Sakura took that hit. Sorry but I really, really did not like him in that moment….he sounded like he was turning everything on himself, like before, and that’s just….weak. not everything that happens has to do with you R!Syaoran >.> Or anytime he grabbed her instead of talking with her.  Even Kurogane said silent guys are annoying (here here!)

The funniest thing is that people say that Syaoran-kun was over protective, when R!Syaoran is the real one like that.  He grabs her, thinking that’s all it takes to get her to listen.  Where Syaoran-kun would tell her, like back in Lake Country, that she shouldn’t do certain things because of valid reasons.  And when she could, he supported her.  He was scared and nervous whenever there was something she was putting herself up to, like in the Country of Idols or even Piffle, but he would be there smiling for her and trusting her.  Not all this grab, grab, grab….which by the way freaks her out because R!Syaoran seems to be moving with his heart memories while not having any body memories to back up his touches :p  Naughty, naughty.  Especially since there’s a different logic between “appropriate” touches between two people in Japanese culture.

Couldn't it have been R!Syaoran's heart that was getting that "warmth" and R!Syaoran's heart that was "melting"?

R!Syaoran had to have been melted or whatever you wanted to call it before going into that tube or else he wouldn’t have risked precious things to him like relationship, time, and freedom to not only protect Sakura and Watanuki, but to give chance to the clone as well :/

Okay, I just thought of something slightly OT but.. How did Fujitaka know to name him Syaoran? Was it "hitsuzen" (probably!)?

OH!  That’s soooo weird that you said that!!! xDD I originally put that in my last post and saying why name him Syaoran when the plan was to just kill the kid off…and then I said you would probably say that it would be so he could be easily replaced by R!Syaoran, like a placeholder…but I thought I sounded like a jerk to presume so I edited it out….  But sharing that just made me sound like one anyways >D  Yea, I brought that up on the last SyaraonxSakura (version1.0 lol) thread before it was mysteriously deleted but, that doesn’t mean we have an answer to it yet. LoL.

On a side note…thank you for being a R!SyaoranxSakura fan who doesn’t use the argument “because I feel sorry for him…” as validation of why he should be with Sakura. I respect you greatly because of it <3

[redeternity]

No, no.  I mean he’d have to know that in Syaoran-kun’s heart there was an affection for Sakura separate from himself.  Or else testing that “Sakura is most precious” thing would be pointless.  As in, in order for him to come up with the theory he had to know of a previous affection for Sakura being in Syaoran-kun….

No because when R!Syaoran said the whole thing about Sakura being precious, at that stage there was no more "Syaoran-kun"/"Our!Syaoran".. he was gone. There was only the heartless clone left. He knew that somebody's heart had an affection for Sakura (because he watched everything through the eye). He knew that the affection either came from his own heart or a possible grown heart in Cloney.. or both. Therefore it was a way of testing whether the Clone had grown his own heart.
Uhhh I wrote a load more about this whilst getting more and more confused.. so I deleted it.. sorry..

So you DO admit Syaoran-kun had a heart/was seperate?
At the beginning you were saying it was only R!Syaoran’s to begin with but---not anymore…..? =3

Right, okay:
The Clone = A body without a heart
R!Syaoran = A body with a full heart (half of which he temporarily lost but has now regained)
Our!Syaoran = R!Syaoran’s half heart living in the clone’s body.

Lolz look I even drew a little family tree!

So anyway, when the seal broke the half heart he had went back to R!Syaoran.. which leaves us with the Clone’s body with no heart inside it (like it was originally).
And as Our!Syaoran IS the clone’s body + half a heart.. Without the heart he doesn’t exist anymore.
Gaawd, it’s so hard to say exactly what I mean. I’m gonna give up now!

EDIT: Actually lets put this another way.. I think it’s the use of the our!syaoran thats confusing me. In fact, when I first came to this forum I was confused who “our!Syaoran” even was.

Basically I think there are only 2 existances really... The Clone and R!Syaoran.. The Clone was just different depending on the timeline!
The beginning                              After R!Syao interfered                       After R!Syao takes back his heart
Clone without heart       --->             Clone with heart                   --->        Clone without heart again

Yea, see, he has a nice heart *pets it*, but not a strong one.  Strong would have been to defend himself instead of standing there getting pegged by those stones.  What does standing there prove?  It proves that you‘re guilty.  Taking the blame moronically for something you didn‘t do.  Strong would have been being beside Sakura, knowing that (if it‘s what he wants…idk for sure yet) she will never love him but still smiling for her like Syaoran-kun was doing when he knew their relationship was gone. 

The whole thing about that though is that unlike “Our!Syao” (temporary xD), R!Syaoran does have faults (that’s why I love him so much more <3) Because wasn’t the half-heart R!Syao gave “Our!Syao” supposed to be the good side, whilst he was left with the bad side inside him (yin yang and all that)? Is CLAMP really trying to get the moral across that being unrealistically perfect=automatic win?

Strong would have been not starting to say crap about “Are you leaving because of me?” when Sakura took that hit.

You mean that bit just before she got stabbed by Fai? Lets face it though that’s what all us readers were thinking at that stage. Remember when everyone hated Sakura (I didn’t) when she was trying to leave because they assumed that she just couldn’t stand being around R!Syaoran and the group anymore?

Or anytime he grabbed her instead of talking with her.

That is such a CCS!Syaoran thing to do though! Keeping quiet.. showing his emotions through his eyes.. not properly explaining how he feels but doing physical things to show he cares.. And if Sakura is supposed to be like her CCS counterpart.. she should be falling for R!Syaoran since he has the same soul as the CCS!Syaoran that CCS!Sakura fell in love with.. The full heart.. (not only the half that Our!Syaoran had).. with flaws and all.

R!Syaoran had to have been melted or whatever you wanted to call it before going into that tube or else he wouldn’t have risked precious things to him like relationship, time, and freedom to not only protect Sakura and Watanuki, but to give chance to the clone as well :/

Well CCS!Syaoran (sorry, keep mentioning him ) had always cared for people, just not loved... Like, true love.
Soooo, even before R!Syaoran’s heart melted he still could have cared for Watanuki.. Just not loved him like I think he does for Sakura.. It was the love that melted his heart.. not just simply caring for someone. IMO.

On a side note…thank you for being a R!SyaoranxSakura fan who doesn’t use the argument “because I feel sorry for him…” as validation of why he should be with Sakura. I respect you greatly because of it <3

And I know it's not really quite the same thing but, thank you for not just using the argument that the Clone should be with Sakura simply because “he was there from the beginning”. Loads of people seem to use that and, to me, that is not a valid argument since it was actually FWR that put him there in the first place.

[Mari]

>Sorry, but the quote button isn't working for me ^^;;

The Clone = A body without a heart
R!Syaoran = A body with a full heart (half of which he temporarily lost but has now regained)
Our!Syaoran = R!Syaoran’s half heart living in the clone’s body Syaoran-kun.

+
Sakura = Wife to all

He knew that somebody's heart had an affection for Sakura (because he watched everything through the eye). He knew that the affection either came from his own heart or a possible grown heart in Cloney.. or both.

Soooo, even before R!Syaoran’s heart melted he still could have cared for Watanuki.. Just not loved him like I think he does for Sakura.. It was the love that melted his heart.. not just simply caring for someone. IMO.

If Syaoran-kun was supposed to be the good side then why did he need to be “melted”? >.>  And if there was no "relationship" or love because there was no “warmth” then the price would be unsatisfactory :/

R!Syaoran does have faults

*coughs* He surely does….

Actually.  Being perfect=auto fail in this fandom.  Which is why people don’t like Syaoran-kun or Sakura (that and the fact she’s a girl…).  It kills me when people knock on him and Sakura for being perfect.  I mean, even something little like how he let Sakura off to faint back in Lake showed he had faults too.  You might think R!Syaoran’s little things are cute but I can’t see anything of R!Syaoran RIGHT NOW other than a poorly developed character.  IMO CLAMP screwed the boy over big time.  I had big hopes for him and he turned out to be more of a panel-filler and an angst maker.  I’m sorry if I sound like a *word that probably shouldn’t be used in forum* but it’s truly how I feel at this point in the story…..nothing to do with R! really, more to do with how CLAMP has portrayed him thus far.

And maybe his spot up to Syaoran-kun’s that lowers him.  Syaoran-kun was the main character so we got to see inside his mind where R! it’s totally the opposite…instead of mysterious it just makes him flat.  When I read it I feel like CLAMP keeps him that way because they’re not entirely sure of his fate yet so they don’t want him saying anything that could screw up a plan that hasn’t been formed yet….which in turn makes the story flat :/

He's really bad at being like his CCS! counterpart though, because one of the greatest things he had with CCS!Sakura was to be able to talk to work things out that they only knew.


You mean that bit just before she got stabbed by Fai? Lets face it though that’s what all us readers were thinking at that stage.

Everyone?  Stay off the Tsubasa forums.  They only hurt your brain xDD Sakura is/has been my favorite character from the beginning <3  Anyone who actually reads the series would have known she wouldn’t do something like that.  It’s just in that moment, to say that, it was so awkward and whiny xP  I really didn’t like the whole Infinity Arc.  Mostly because R!Syaoran didn’t live up to holding interest to keep the story going.

It’s sort of sad.  Most of the hype around here about ZOMG new chapters!! Died with that arc :/

doing physical things to show he cares....

It is defiantly not coming out that way.  Instead it’s like he’s trying to hold her back and “over” protect her, like I was saying.  If he cared he would have had a closer eye on her, instead he failed and it seemed Kuro-pon was even was more aware of what she was up to.

And I know it's not really quite the same thing but, thank you for not just using the argument that the Clone should be with Sakura simply because “he was there from the beginning”. Loads of people seem to use that and, to me, that is not a valid argument since it was actually FWR that put him there in the first place.

LoL I think it’s pretty much exactly the same ^^;;  because it’s the counter argument of “he’s there right now so they should be together”
And actually hitsuzen brought him there xDD



Ok.  It feels like our conversation is going in circles now and for the last five posts >.>

I’m sure both of us sound really stupid to all viewers of this thread (Yay to us xD)  We’re fighting for things that we don’t know all about, so what we’re doing is trying to push our own theories out against each other when they don’t want to be taken ^.^;;

So let me try something else.  I wanna ask you this since I know your view will be different:

What do you think R!Syaoran’s referring to when he said “even if that heart doesn’t return….”?

[redeternity]

If Syaoran-kun was supposed to be the good side then why did he need to be “melted”? >.>

Eh, I dunno :/ I think he was "a bit off" (as Touya put it) at the start because he had no memories prior to being found by Fujitaka.. maybe..

Actually.  Being perfect=auto fail in this fandom.  Which is why people don’t like Syaoran-kun or Sakura (that and the fact she’s a girl…).  It kills me when people knock on him and Sakura for being perfect.

..I don't like the TRC fandom very much. People are a little overly harsh on Syaoran and Sakura due to their total love of KuroFai I think. Sorry because I am one of those people who does find Cloney a bit too perfect and uninteresting (until he went all heartless and psycho and hawt.. I have a thing for "evil" psycho characters.. Like Light from Death Note lol). But despite the fact I don't overly like him, I do find it quite depressing when people are always bashing him (and Sakura). In fact, people seem to sometimes bash R!Syaoran for simply being in a chapter, like "he's getting in the way of the KuroFai romance" or something. PAH! If/when KuroFai happens, it will happen, regardless of whether Syaoran happens to be in their panel at the same time or not xD Don't complain about Syaoran, complain to CLAMP!
(Actually, I like KuroFai myself but don't get whats sooooo great about them. And why a load of fangirls insist on drawing fanarts with Fai dressed up as a woman in the arms of a bulky Kurogane.. thats not hot.. it's just wrong..)

Anyway, as for Sakura, I thought she was fine in TRC. It's just Cloney I didn't like. There's a very good reason why Sakura is slightly different in TRC to CCS and thats because she lost her memories.. Since her memories make up who she is as a person. The first chapter before she lost them and in all her childhood memories, she's exactly like her CCS counterpart. And even though I never disliked her, I do definately like her a lot more now that she's being all badass with guns and making her own decisions and whatnot. Much love to her <3

With Sakura and Cloney's relationship.. meh, didn't do much for me. Sorry. There was the whole thing about her forgetting him which was admittedly very sad. I remember crying during that scene when she said "Who are you?" and he went out into the rain. But a little while after that, they were all smiley and blushy with each other again.. getting agitated when one of them was in trouble.. holding hands and stuff.. and it just felt a bit like.. okay, so she's obviously fallen in love with him again *yawn*. And the whole way through it was very much the case of "Syaoran the hero" and "Sakura the damsel in distress". And since they're supposed to be teenagers, the whole cutesy thing to their relationship didn't work. *realises she's on an S+S thread* Please don't kill me >< Just my opinion.

You might think R!Syaoran’s little things are cute but I can’t see anything of R!Syaoran RIGHT NOW other than a poorly developed character.  IMO CLAMP screwed the boy over big time.  I had big hopes for him and he turned out to be more of a panel-filler and an angst maker.

I think there will definately be much more to R!Syaoran in the future than just the emo-guy who angsts. And keep in mind, he did come in at a rather angsty part of the story.. although in a way he caused thr angst but it's not really his fault, poor guy. I know what you mean when you said about him being annoying because he doesn't speak up enough and I respect your opinion.. I just find him a hell of a lot more interesting and attractive than I ever found his clone.

He's really bad at being like his CCS! counterpart though, because one of the greatest things he had with CCS!Sakura was to be able to talk to work things out that they only knew.

But keep in mind it is a very different situation to CCS. The Syaoran is CCS didn't have to put up with feeling like a "replacement".. and besides, CCS Syaoran only spoke to Sakura about the Clow Cards.. never really about his emotions/feelings (except the confession and everything after that.. obviously)

I’m sure both of us sound really stupid to all viewers of this thread (Yay to us xD) 

Anyone who's followed our conversation this far deserves a medal or something. Especially if they've managed to understand my posts when I don't even understand half of what I'm saying myself. And since they're obviously interested enough in the subject they should come and join in our discussion *hint*. But we've probably scared everyone off by now xD

What do you think R!Syaoran’s referring to when he said “even if that heart doesn’t return….”?

Hmm.. I think by "that heart" he's referring to the heart that was temporarily in the Clone. He says "even if that heart won't return. I'll protect her no matter what.. Sakura".. so I think he's saying that even if that heart won't go back to the Clone (and he stated before that it can't) he will still protect Sakura...
But thats as far as I can guess. I'm really not entirely sure. What do you think about it?

[Mari]

Eh, I dunno :/ I think he was "a bit off" (as Touya put it) at the start because he had no memories prior to being found by Fujitaka.. maybe..

*tilts head* Eh?

I don't like the TRC fandom very much...

Seconding that.

And yay.  She described her discontent for Syaoran-kun without using the word “boring.”  Uninteresting sounds less demeaning…lol.  EVERY character gets bashed from getting in the way of KuroxFay >.>  but mostly from the people who are rather insecure and don’t have total love for their OTP =3 Yea.  Poor R!Syaoran put up with a lot of crap, just because he was standing next to them…or even going to Celes with them…I don’t think he’s much of a “interference” now that he’s on the floor…yet, no one seems to care the actual plot is somewhere around him not on the current battle (get back to plot plz&thnx CLAMP xD)

*realises she's on an S+S thread*

She realizes after all the scene referencing I had to do for her xP
But meh.  It’s really the SxSxS thread until we find out what’s going on with Syaoran(s)~

It’s sort of strange how they are overly cute and innocent.  I find it adorable but none the less…they act a lot younger then how CCS! Syaoran and Sakura don’t they? >.>  Which then leads to the lame fan fiction about them acting like nine year olds in fan fiction…gah.

I think there will definitely be much more to R!Syaoran in the future

Better be xD Though I’m not too happy with him now I still love the guy.  Especially when his face gets all shadowed/shaded xD

only spoke to Sakura about the Clow Cards…

That‘s what I‘m talking about.  They shared the Clow cards in CCS…they’re sharing this, being up against this FWR,  together now but he’s been keeping it all to himself.  It might help Sakura a little if she knew more about the person after her body…and I know CLAMP is going to do something to cover it, saying crap about giving too many options and future changing but it’s really killing their relationship, whatever it may be, in the meantime…

What do you think about it?

That whole thing Clow was saying before that just confused me even more--or maybe the translations for it did.  Because in one of the translations it was saying how the “him/he” wasn’t a definite pronoun, just like an “it”  And then there’s the whole blood related thing….CLAMP does an awesome job messing with my mind.  I originally thought he was talking about the clone’s “heart” too…but how it’s said is strange.  Almost like it was a separate heart…not a piece, like he had loaned.

[EDIT] Lmao.  I didn't even see your family tree! Or the timeline It's true.  You really, really have too much time xDD

[redeternity]

Now you're the one replying too quickly

Poor R!Syaoran put up with a lot of crap, just because he was standing next to them…or even going to Celes with them…I don’t think he’s much of a “interference” now that he’s on the floor…yet, no one seems to care the actual plot is somewhere around him not on the current battle (get back to plot plz&thnx CLAMP xD)

So true. I've gotta say the past 2 or so chapters have been so boring (and I feel so Syaoran deprived lately ;_;). Even Syaoran is bored with the fight. He told them to "hurry up" in chapter 161 xD Actually, I wonder.. how is he/are they planning on saving Sakura from dying? They need to get the soul back to the body and in order to do that they need to get into the dream world. Syaoran has been there, but he wasn't in the same part Sakura was in. And whatever made him go to the dream world in the first place is definately to do with Watanuki I think. But I wanna know what!! And I can't theorize yet because I haven't read past xxxholic volume 3  .. I will try and catch up in this 3 week break.

She realizes after all the scene referencing I had to do for her xP
But meh.  It’s really the SxSxS thread until we find out what’s going on with Syaoran(s)~

Btw, is there a Syaoran x Syaoran thread anywhere around here? It's my second favourite pairing in TRC, even if it is crack  . There should be one!!

It’s sort of strange how they are overly cute and innocent.  I find it adorable but none the less…they act a lot younger then how CCS! Syaoran and Sakura don’t they? >.>

Yeah, exactly. It's really odd. Where were their hormones?!?!? And am I the only one that cringes everytime I see this splash?
Ehh, it feels so weird when you look back on TRC's first 14-ish volumes.. I sometimes wonder if I'm reading the same manga.

they’re sharing this, being up against this FWR,  together now but he’s been keeping it all to himself.

I'm not sure if he even knows a great deal more about FWR than any of the rest of them. I mean, yes, somehow he knew about FWR's plan (CLAMP haven't told us how - maybe Clow told him? Or Yuuko?) but he told Kurogane that he couldn't help them because he didn't know what dimension FWR was in or anything like that..

and I know CLAMP is going to do something to cover it, saying crap about giving too many options and future changing

Sorry, what?

That whole thing Clow was saying before that just confused me even more--or maybe the translations for it did.  Because in one of the translations it was saying how the “him/he” wasn’t a definite pronoun, just like an “it”  And then there’s the whole blood related thing….CLAMP does an awesome job messing with my mind.

Heh, me too. But o.O ..an "it"??! All the translations I saw translated it as him/he.
This is what I thought about it:
"Even if he's someone you should have met, you can't meet him"
"Even if you stretch out your hand you can’t touch him”
"Even if he reflects in your eyes you can't reach him" - I think he's talking to Sakura here for all these 3 lines about not being able to meet/touch/reach R!Syaoran. But he could possibly be talking to Cloney about R!Syaoran.

Then he says: “even if you’ve chosen them for yourself, the painful things won’t change. Even like this.. you want to protect right? Once you have decided something you can't resent that.” - 100% sure he's talking to R!Syaoran here. But not sure what he means by "even like this".
Then he says “This too is like being blood related” – WTF? Have no idea what he means here.

But whatever the case, I think Clow definately knew R!Syaoran was watching through Cloney's eye.
Woah, actually a thought occured to me.. maybe CLAMP were tricking us and that whole speech was directed towards R!Syaoran about Watanuki? Just a thought.

I originally thought he was talking about the clone’s “heart” too…but how it’s said is strange.  Almost like it was a separate heart…not a piece, like he had loaned.

[EDIT] Lmao.  I didn't even see your family tree! Or the timeline It's true.  You really, really have too much time xDD

I hope nobody else has lost a heart or half a heart or something. 'Cause that just means more confusion.
And nah, it only took me a couple of minutes on paint lol

[Mari]

Now you're the one replying too quickly

Well….ummm…that is-- *hides behind tree*
You’ll miss me when I’m gone next week xP

And I can't theorize yet because I haven't read past xxxholic volume 3  .. I will try and catch up in this 3 week break.

GET ON THAT!  There’s important stuff in the recent chapters while Sakura and Watanuki are talking in the dream.  Like about how Sakura knows her and Syaoran-kun share the same birthday…how Watanuki means April 1st…and now Watanuki can’t remember his parents names!!!  Also she comments a lot about how Watanuki and R!Syaoran are alike which sort of reminds me in CCS when Sakura was saying her father and Eriol were very alike….but I don’t think R!Syaoran is a piece of Clow or of Watanuki or anything like that He doesn’t where glasses after all xDD

That really pretty splash of Sakura back in 160--for a second I thought her body was starting to decompose but it was the overlap they were using ^^;;

Btw, is there a Syaoran x Syaoran thread anywhere around here? It's my second favourite pairing in TRC, even if it is crack  . There should be one!!

Sadly no.  Even if more people support SyaoranxSyaoran then Sakura with either xP  There’s a non-canon thread here and a Syaoran!cest community at LJ (where someone just posted a nice little fanart :3) but that’s all I know of.  I've been searching for SyaoranxSyaoran fanfics myself :/

Yeah, exactly. It's really odd. Where were their hormones?!?!?

Back in Clow?

And am I the only one that cringes everytime I see this splash?

I totally thought SyaoranxYuuko (=“butterfly”) when I clicked.  Now there’s a crack!pairing xD

I'm not sure if he even knows a great deal more about FWR than any of the rest of them. I mean, yes, somehow he knew about FWR's plan (CLAMP haven't told us how - maybe Clow told him? Or Yuuko?) but he told Kurogane that he couldn't help them because he didn't know what dimension FWR was in or anything like that..

Still how he ended up there and his connections.  If he wanted to stop FWR and FWR knew this, then there’s obviously some pieces we’re missing out on.  They’ll come in time…or they better >.>

>>>and I know CLAMP is going to do something to cover it, saying crap about giving too many options and future changing....

As in how Sakura couldn’t tell anyone about her dream, or about who was going to be stabbed because choices only create more options, which then make the future harder to control.

Woah, actually a thought occured to me.. maybe CLAMP were tricking us and that whole speech was directed towards R!Syaoran about Watanuki? Just a thought.

Could make a little more sense about blood related I guess…
Gah.  I don’t know what to guess anymore
All I know is that R!Syaoran looked really good in that silhouette in his room xD

I hope nobody else has lost a heart or half a heart or something. 'Cause that just means more confusion.
And nah, it only took me a couple of minutes on paint lol

Just watch.  It turns out that the real Sakura’s memories were erased as a child on so that “heart” was the one R!Syaoran loved…and so even if that “Sakura” won’t return, he’s still going to protect her. 

And so the theory will be proved with Sakura’s twin entering in this upcoming drama. Lol.
Like we don’t have enough of those running around…though I’m not altogether against Fay!twin (They’re really both sort of Fay at this point I suppose…>.>) making an appearance and giving Kuro-sama some fun =3

And nah, it only took me a couple of minutes on paint lol

You and your Paint skillz xP Quite flaunting it to the world

[redeternity]

You’ll miss me when I’m gone next week xP

Gone for the whole week??!!! NOOOO!! 

GET ON THAT!  There’s important stuff in the recent chapters while Sakura and Watanuki are talking in the dream.  Like about how Sakura knows her and Syaoran-kun share the same birthday…how Watanuki means April 1st…and now Watanuki can’t remember his parents names!!!  Also she comments a lot about how Watanuki and R!Syaoran are alike which sort of reminds me in CCS when Sakura was saying her father and Eriol were very alike….but I don’t think R!Syaoran is a piece of Clow or of Watanuki or anything like that He doesn’t where glasses after all xDD

Ah, well I've read the recent chapters of xxxholic with Sakura and Syaoran.. and up to volume 3.. just not the stuff inbetween. Luckily I don't think I've really spoiled anything for myself by doing that. And yeah.. how did she know about Cloney's birthday being April 1st?? Unless he told her at some point during their travels and I missed it.

I keep thinking R!Syaoran and Watanuki are like, family related. Because Watanuki looks so much like Clow and since R!Syaoran is meant to be blood related to Clow Reed (and presumebly FWR too since they both share the surname "Reed") then maybe R!Syaoran and Watanuki are brothers or something?? And Watanuki just can't remember him because his feathers got sent across alternate dimensions xD for some reason.
Worst case scenario: R!Syaoran is FWR's son xD But the only way this could be possible would be if his mother was extremely beautiful and he got all his genes from her lol.

Sadly no.  Even if more people support SyaoranxSyaoran then Sakura with either xP  There’s a non-canon thread here and a Syaoran!cest community at LJ (where someone just posted a nice little fanart :3) but that’s all I know of.  I've been searching for SyaoranxSyaoran fanfics myself :/

Looks like the syaorancest community at LJ is members only though. Drat. I don't even have an LJ account - I'm too shy lol.
And ZOMGJSKDHGBEUSINKLD!!!!111 That Syaorancest fanart!! ..wow..!! *saves* Thanks for sharing! I need more!! xD I suddenly have the urge to draw my own fanart of them.. shame I can't draw very well 

On a sadder note, I notice that the Flouritecest community has more members than the Syaorancest one. Seriously, wtf is going on?? Syaorancest is love! Syaoran is love! <3 <3 I hate you TRC fandom! *sulks*

Back in Clow?

LOL

Still how he ended up there and his connections.

Dunno, perhaps Yuuko sent him there? Since we know he can't dimension travel on his own and he'd know which dimension he was in if he actually lived there. But then it still leaves the question of how he knew in the first place - I think Clow Reed or Clow-ou.

All I know is that R!Syaoran looked really good in that silhouette in his room xD

Syaoran always looks good

And so the theory will be proved with Sakura’s twin entering in this upcoming drama. Lol.

In a way Sakura does have a twin. Well, sort of. Since there are kinda two of her - her body and soul. CLAMP really love the whole twin (and eyes) theme don't they?

You and your Paint skillz xP Quite flaunting it to the world

You're just jealous! ....Yeah, I think I'll go reaquaint myself with photoshop...

[Mari]

Gone for the whole week??!!! NOOOO!! 

Crap load of filing = seclusion.
I’ll be on to spam you PM box but not as much~

And yeah.. how did she know about Cloney's birthday being April 1st?? Unless he told her at some point during their travels and I missed it.

Apparently Syaoran-kun told her back in Piffle (ch137) O.o Wasn’t she supposed to faint or something….and why the hell did CLAMP exclude such an adorable moment from meeeee >.>

And Watanuki just can't remember him because his feathers got sent across alternate dimensions xD for some reason.

*pictures Watanuki with wings*
*brain ded*

Worst case scenario: R!Syaoran is FWR's son xD But the only way this could be possible would be if his mother was extremely beautiful and he got all his genes from her lol.

Lolz~

Looks like the syaorancest community at LJ is members only though. Drat. I don't even have an LJ account - I'm too shy lol.

Ah, right.  I forgot.  >.> Since I’m a member I don’t even pay attention xDD
…shy?  EXCUSES!!!

And ZOMGJSKDHGBEUSINKLD!!!!111 That Syaorancest fanart!! ..wow..!! *saves* Thanks for sharing! I need more!! xD I suddenly have the urge to draw my own fanart of them.. shame I can't draw very well 

Maybe you can use your amazing Paint skillz….DO IT!!! 8D

On a sadder note, I notice that the Flouritecest community has more members than the Syaorancest one. Seriously, wtf is going on?? Syaorancest is love! Syaoran is love! <3 <3 I hate you TRC fandom! *sulks*

Because now there’s two Fay’s to love xP


In an attempt to steer our conversation back OT *shifty eyes*…. I was thinking about this…what did you make of Subaru knowing who Sakura’s most precious person was???  She didn’t even seem to know right away until he started nudging her that he wouldn’t return…

[redeternity]

I’ll be on to spam you PM box but not as much~

You can't spam me much. I'm only allowed 5 PMs ^___^.

Apparently Syaoran-kun told her back in Piffle (ch137) O.o Wasn’t she supposed to faint or something….and why the hell did CLAMP exclude such an adorable moment from meeeee >.>

What??! How was that ever there?? I swear that panel with the picture of Syaoran and Sakura in piffle was never in that chapter of 'holic when I read it before!! Eh, oh well. Lol.
Annnyway, speaking of missing scenes, I've been thinking that there might be quite a few more scenes CLAMP hasn't shown us. For example, I noticed this a while back but.. here (top right panel) it really looks like Sakura-hime has another premonition after touching Fai's hand. Yes/no?

…shy?  EXCUSES!!!

Heh, I actually am kinda shy. Why do you think I lurk so much? *blush*

Maybe you can use your amazing Paint skillz….DO IT!!! 8D

Is that an order? xD
Alas, my drawing skills on paint are worse than my drawing-on-paper skills. The lines come out all wobbly and I'd go insane after about 5 minutes or trying to keep a steady hand.

In an attempt to steer our conversation back OT *shifty eyes*…. I was thinking about this…what did you make of Subaru knowing who Sakura’s most precious person was???  She didn’t even seem to know right away until he started nudging her that he wouldn’t return…

Hmmm I never really thought about that before actually! You could also ask the question how he knew Syaoran wouldn't return (meaning that he knew Syaoran was a clone and the seal was breaking). I guess.. because he has power? Because the powerful people in Tsubasa can seemingly figure out anything. e.g. Yuuko already knew what was most important to Syaoran, Fai and Kurogane without having to ask them. Or alternatively maybe Subaru just saw another Syaoran and Sakura together whilst he was travelling with Kamui. If so, I wanna see them too! (Thats another thing.. Will the TRC gang ever run into another world version of themselves? And why is it that this has not happened already?)
<random>Btw, did you know Subaru was named after a car?! xD I saw one the other day and I was like ZOMG IT'S SUBARU! How have I never noticed this before??</random>

I'm interested to know your opinion on this... What did you make of what Syaoran said back in chapter 134 about something he wants to get back: here and here? He is definately staring straight at Sakura when he says it.

[Mari]

You can't spam me much. I'm only allowed 5 PMs ^___^.

Ahahah.  You newbie >D

Annnyway, speaking of missing scenes, I've been thinking that there might be quite a few more scenes CLAMP hasn't shown us. For example, I noticed this a while back but.. here (top right panel) it really looks like Sakura-hime has another premonition after touching Fai's hand. Yes/no?

I’m sure there’s multiple scenes CLAMP forgot to put in hasn’t shown us xP  I know it’s hard, since there’s already so much going on, but I wish they would learn to incorporate these things in the story because they end up looking like plot holes >.>

Heh, I actually am kinda shy. Why do you think I lurk so much? *blush*

LIES.

Is that an order? xD

Yessss.

ZOMG IT'S SUBARU! How have I never noticed this before??</random>

LOL!  I always think of that Subaru when I see the car too =3

I'm interested to know your opinion on this... What did you make of what Syaoran said back in chapter 134 about something he wants to get back: here and here? He is definately staring straight at Sakura when he says it.

I guess it all goes back to the “I have to get it back, no matter what” then “will he make it in time?” and then “he didn’t make it in time” and other various mentions  Nothing seems to lead to Sakura directly (he only looked at her with the protect part) and nothing seems to make sense of having to be there in Tokyo to get something back in that moment unless it’s having to do with Syaoran-kun….

And so then Mari started thinking about eyes xP
(just using C! and R! to reference bodies)

Beginning:
C!Syaoran has R!Syaoran’s LEFT eye in his RIGHT eye
R!Syaoran has C!Syaoran’s RIGHT eye in his RIGHT eye


After Toyko:
R!Syaoran has his LEFT eye in his LEFT
R!Syaoran still has C!Syaoran’s RIGHT eye in his RIGHT eye (which seems to be effecting him recently...)
C!Syaoran has “a LEFT” eye in his LEFT
C!Syaoran has Fay’s LEFT eye in his RIGHT

Where the hell is R!Syaoran’s RIGHT eye???

What’s more, it seems R!Syaoran’s LEFT eye has the ability to see in the dream world Sakura and Watanuki frequent

This then goes back to the “to go to the person who this right eye came from” where we were all thinking shouldn’t it be “to go to the person who has this left eye?”  So I guess we can assume R!Syaoran TOOK the right eye, and placed the seal and a piece of his heart in there instead?  Explains why the kid can’t see at all…

Also in Syaoran-kun’s dreams it’s strange that C!Syaoran is imaged like R!Syaoran. With where the patch is on his eye?  If it was truly C!Syaoran and Syaoran-kun were one in the same, then shouldn’t he have a patch over his other eye???  And you can tell who is who because R!Syaoran has his tattoos on and C!Syaoran doesn’t have any.  Not to mention it’s odd that C!Syaoran and R!Syaoran both call Syaoran-kun “Syaoran” in the dreams (Which brings to question, if it was only a piece of a heart that made up Syaoran-kun, I don’t think R!Syaoran would be calling him “Syaoran” )

The looking the same thing really makes little sense unless R!Syaoran had “pycho nature” in his body the whole time, and the seal was just ensuring that “pycho nature” couldn’t get to Syaoran-kun’s body….Because apparently, according to C!Syaoran he’s been “waiting for so long…”

What does this all mean? I wish I knew

I suppose I’m saying it’s more likely, at this point, that R!Syaoran is looking for his right eye opposed to trying to get, for instance, a relationship back with Sakura.  Maybe his right eye even has something to do with her though and it’s a danger to her and that’s why he’s protecting her.  unless she has the right eye in her along with a piece of his heart LOL.

But then you start adding in  Sakura’s “From now on, you can be free” and I have no freakin’ clue what’s going on >.>
...and it probably has little do with eyes but...I was on an eye high >P

There's still so much missing and that's why I'm finding it hard to believe that R!Syaoran and Sakura will be together.  That and the fact I get creeped out  that R!Syaoran would be wearing Syaoran-kun's clothes from Clow *shivers*

On another note, I wonder if Sakura is 100% sure that her Syaoran's heart is still out there....and I wonder if it has something to do with her power to "hear lonely voices/those who have no voice"  I was sort of thinking about that since I saw this splash with Syaoran-kun when he was younger and it said "Even if this body should meet it's end, these feeling alone will remain in a corner of the world"

[cryingforthemoon]

Personally, I agree with redeternity. Unfortunately, I have nothing to add to the conversation since everything's already been laid out and we won't know any more until CLAMP tells us. I have been a fan of Syaoran since CCS as well, so I may be biased in my favoring R!Syaoran. I just found the clone one-dimensional, creepy, and artificial from the beginning. I was like-what has CLAMP done to Syaoran!? Then I found out about the whole R!Syaoran/C!Syaoran thing and I'm like Ohhh, so that's why I felt that way.

If C!Syaoran had grown a heart, even in the slightest measure, I don't think R!Syaoran would've tried to kill him. He seemed to really care for his clone like a brother, so I think he really tried his best to make sure there wasn't anything there before he tried to kill him. He was obviously very upset at the prospect of killing him, but he didn't want the heartless clone killing anyone. R!Syaoran would've tried to subdue the clone in some other manner and not tried to kill him if he really believed there was even the tiniest seed of a heart there.

Plus, if C!Syaoran has his own heart, then he's not really a "Syaoran" at all, he's someone else-a completely different person. I have wondered if CLAMP might do that-the clone's body will "die", but his heart that he grew (if that turns out to be true somehow) would go into another body (Watanuki maybe, though I would rather him be with Doumeki). That would mean no Sakura x Syaoran in TRC, it would be "whoever the clone ended up being by growing his own heart" x Sakura, and as a Sakura x Syaoran shipper, I'm totally against that. :p

Another thing I almost forgot- What happens if what you're saying is true and C!Syaoran regains his "lost" heart? He'll have the memories of killing countless people. Even if by some chance, his heart doesn't remember the murdering because it was the clone "program" doing it, he'll still feel the intense guilt and pain deep inside I would imagine. He'll live his life with Sakura, but have nightmares forever about the things he did. I just can't see C!Syaoran getting "his" heart back as a good thing. His body has committed countless murders and god knows what else, and if he finds out he was given his heart initially by R!Syaoran, I just can't see him being happy about that. He will be a very sad person, and become much different than the one you all seem to treasure.

Plus, the shameless fangirl in me is like "R!Syaoran is more interesting and angsty and hot!" Squeee! Plus, wouldn't it be hot if C!Syaoran and R!Syaoran merged, complete with (Touya x Yue)-like "almost kiss" The Syaorancest-shipper in me likeys...it's yummy!

...and I know CLAMP will develop him more as the chapters go on. He's still the cutesy, blushy guy that his half-self was. R!Syaoran has those aspects of his personality, but isn't showing them for Sakura's sake, the situation at hand, and maybe for his own sake as well. Everything is just too angsty right now to not be emo. I think once Sakura's body and soul are reunited and Celes is finished that R!Syaoran will start showing his personality more and showing those aspects which were displayed by his clone. Maybe that's the main reason (other than the mood at the time) why CLAMP didn't show drunk R!Syaoran-it would show those other aspects that were in his other (yang) half. ("yang" is C!Syaoran before releasing the 1/2 heart to R!Syaoran as opposed to R!Syaoran-pre-getting-his-other-1/2-heart-back as "yin"---they are 2 opposing halves of the same person) CLAMP is really big on yin and yang, aren't they? BTW, yin and yang don't refer to "good" and "evil" at all. I keep seeing people posting that...

I just wanted to exclaim my support for R!Syaoran, and I ended up writing so much. Sorry for the rambling... 

R!Syaoran x Sakura forever!
(although a little R!Syaoran x C!Syaoran fanservice would be the cherry on top! XD

[cryingforthemoon]

Wow. It would be nice if people would act like adults and give a reason as to why they would give negative feedback to someone who is only expressing their opinion. I have nothing against anyone, yet so many people seem determined to test the limits of my depression.
Then again, the whole "cookie" system obviously wasn't created by mature adults. It's a "high-school-esque" popularity contest, and god knows I'm not even in the running in those in real life. Why do I even bother getting up in the morning I wonder?

[redeternity]

@ cryingforthemoon - First of all, welcome to CW
Secondly, yay, you're a R!SyaoranxSakura fan!

I agree with most of what you said in your post, particularly the whole thing about Cloney not being the same if he got his heart back due to all the mass-murdering he's been doing. This was something I have been thinking too.

Plus, if C!Syaoran has his own heart, then he's not really a "Syaoran" at all, he's someone else-a completely different person.

I wondered this too but it's not definate that this would be the case. It's uncertain whether if he grew a heart it would be like R!Syaoran's (same soul/personality) or if it would be completely different.

Plus, wouldn't it be hot if C!Syaoran and R!Syaoran merged, complete with (Touya x Yue)-like "almost kiss" The Syaorancest-shipper in me likeys...it's yummy!

Although I completely agree that an almost kiss would be hot (a proper kiss would be better though!!) ..why merge? I don't get it when people say they should merge. If C!Syaoran and R!Syaoran merged all that would be merging would be the bodies since Cloney has no heart to merge with R!Syaoran's. However, if he has grown his own heart then it could be one of two things:.
1. If the heart is the same as R!Syaoran's (same soul/personality) then merging would again produce the same person.
2. If it is different to R!Syaoran's (different soul/personality) it would produce a different person who was not "Syaoran" (and we don't want that!)

PS. Poor you for getting a cookie deducted! I would give you one but I can't, unfortunately. Don't take it personally, though, because the same thing happened to me except I actually got THREE deducted for absolutely NO REASON whatsoever. It's probably just some Clone fan getting annoyed because we have a different opinion from them.


@ Mari - What will you do if I refuse to draw the Syaorancest fanart?
I may try drawing it on paper at some point.. But I've never drawn a kiss before.. :/

Nothing seems to lead to Sakura directly (he only looked at her with the protect part)

His sentences are linked to Sakura in both circumstances..
He says: "It probably won't come back BUT if I can protect I want to protect (Sakura)"
and: "EVEN IF that heart won't return I promised to protect her.. Sakura"
So whatever it is that he wants to get back and "that heart" are somehow linked to Sakura (and him protecting her). So then you could take it as Syaoran wanting to get the Clone's heart back for Sakura's sake. But I don't think this is the case because he said so himself that it could never go back to C!Syaoran.

Where the hell is R!Syaoran’s RIGHT eye???

He lost it in all the confusion of the eye switching xD

But seriously though I'd never noticed before that he said that he wanted to go "to the person from whom this right eye came from". But.. I'm confused, if his right eye is from Cloney.. well, I don't get why he'd take it in the first place? Isn't that the eye that can see through to where C!Syaoran is?  Does he still have Cloney's eye then? If so, does that mean that even now, he can still see where Cloney is and what he's doing? o.O

And you make an interesting point about trying to get back his original eye (if he did indeed borrow the Clone's for whatever reason). Maybe he does want to get his eye back.. but.. I hope not. Too confusing @.@

As for in Celes, I thought it was his eye that was causing the problem at first too. But, I'm not convinced - it could just be his head, like an (extreme) headache. But whatever the reason I think it happened because Watanuki was dissapearing rather than having anything to do with Cloney. Although.. the whole headache thing seemed to start RIGHT AFTER he stepped into the castle. Coincidence? I'm not so sure.

Also in Syaoran-kun’s dreams it’s strange that C!Syaoran is imaged like R!Syaoran.

First of all, no way is it because R!Syaoran has a "psycho nature" *huggles him*.
I'm confused about this too but I'll try my hand at explaining what I think might possibly be the case..
Basically, I think the reason why C!Syaoran's true self is dressed in R!Syaoran's attire in his dream is precisely because it's his dream. Dreams.. do not always make perfect sense (infact they rarely do).. add to that they're partly influenced by what you yourself think, right? So, if you think about it C!Syaoran did not know he was a clone. He did not know that his half heart was borrowed. He did not know his true self was coming through.. And he did not know who R!Syaoran was.. But because he saw R!Syaoran previously in his dreams appearing as a little kid, it was his image that he saw again in his dreams in chapter 91 and 113 strangling him and saying "I've been waiting so long". He assumed he was a bad guy like we did at that stage, therefore he saw his true self wearing R!Syaoran's attire because it made more sense to him that way.

..probably xD Haha, yeah the whole thing doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me either. Maybe CLAMP will clear it up in the future.

There's still so much missing and that's why I'm finding it hard to believe that R!Syaoran and Sakura will be together. 

Yeah. I'm not saying a relationship between them is going to happen overnight either. But.. but.. I'm optimistic.. if Syaoran keeps to his promise of protecting Sakura then hopefully he will be the one in the tube with her. Plus, R!Syaoran is one up on Cloney at this stage in that he's actually already been in the dream world, whereas Cloney has not yet. Plus, how is Cloney going to get in without a soul, I wonder?

That and the fact I get creeped out  that R!Syaoran would be wearing Syaoran-kun's clothes from Clow *shivers*

I've been pondering the whole tube thing recently and came up with a lot of questions like..
Was it FWR's plan all along to have Sakura in the tube? Or is she there against his wishes? Maybe it was FWR's plan to get her in the tube but he had planned it some other way.. i wonder if it matters to him which Syaoran is in the tube with her.. Could it be he didn't want R!Syaoran to be the one and so tried to kill him?
I also have another theory.. could it be that the scene we saw in chapter 1 is not what is going to happen in the tube but what COULD HAVE happened had she not changed the future (by being stabbed herself instead of R!Syaoran)?

I saw this splash with Syaoran-kun when he was younger and it said "Even if this body should meet it's end, these feeling alone will remain in a corner of the world"

I wouldn't rely on the teasers on the splash (and at the end of the chapter). I seem to remember reading somewhere that the teasers were not written by CLAMP but by the people publishing the chapters or something?

(gawd I wrote a lot  )

[Mari]

Plus, if C!Syaoran has his own heart, then he's not really a "Syaoran" at all

CLAMP logic here.  Syaoran-kun was named that way and even given a birthday (which I think might be linked in someway to Watanuki).  Those make a Syaoran.

if C!Syaoran and R!Syaoran merged

I don’t understand the whole merge thing either ^^;;  If there’s any "merging" than I would say that it already took place and that was the merge of Syaoran-kun and his “clone program” (because, truly, that’s two pieces of a "soul")  Unlike R!Syaoran who, assuming he stops giving away all odd piece of him, is really a full person.

Celes is finished that R!Syaoran will start showing his personality

I don’t think there’s much to do after Celes, much less time for more development.  CLAMP seems all plot, plot, plot now and we’ve had little time for thoughts and person >.<  Sakura’s soul is already loosing time in the tube so once they get her body it’s really going to start moving. I assume they’ll have to go to Clow--

OH!  SCARY THOUGHT!! BAD SCARY THOUGHT!!

What if Clone already went to Clow country?!?!  Doing the same thing that he was doing everywhere else?!?!
OMG *cries*

@ Mari - What will you do if I refuse to draw the Syaorancest fanart?

I will smite you with the almighty stick of d00m >D
…that reminds me of something!  *goes off to get it for you*

His sentences are linked to Sakura in both circumstances..

Well, yes.  Of course she’s “linked” xP The thing about those lines are they aren’t solid, and there’s blanks that your mind fills.  Sort of how back in Tokyo we had that clip of Real!Fay saying “but before that--” and then people inserted “…I want to be loved”  CLAMP is more or less likely leaving those spaces to make you purposefully think you can fill it in, but I have a feeling it’s not so much the case or as easy as that.

And like that above arch, until R!Syao finally decides to break the silence we can’t be using it to support much of anything :/  It was right to assume back then that the little boy was Our!Fay since we knew of no other…or how everyone passed over the “right eye thing” and assumed it was left…just like right now it’s right that you assume that when he speaks of Sakura he’s talking of TRC!Sakura and her directly…

He lost it in all the confusion of the eye switching xD

The right eye will probably turn up in Watanuki anyways *sigh*
That boy needs to quite lending out body parts

Does he still have Cloney's eye then? If so, does that mean that even now, he can still see where Cloney is and what he's doing? o.O

I don't see why not but I’m not sure about the still seeing part :/ I guess that depends how Fay’s eye is working in C!Syaoran?….it was because he kept Syaoran-kun blind in that eye that R!Syaoran could see I thought (which brings up the question that how can an eye be made not to see…?)

Besides. Everyone knows R!Syaoran is just holdinig onto Syaoran-kun’s right eye so that Fay will get his eye back, Syaoran-kun will get his original right eye back and everything will be good again xDD

First of all, no way is it because R!Syaoran has a "psycho nature" *huggles him*.

No, no.  What I was playing with was that R!Syaoran had been keeping the “clone program” in his body in hopes to give Syaoran-kun a chance to develop a heart of his own so that when the seal on his eye was broken his new heart wouldn’t allow him to be overpowered by the “clone program”

In which case we’d start getting into R!Syaoran puts half his heart and an eye in C!Syaoran, while he takes “half a heart” (clone program) and an eye.  So that the two really have a piece of each other inside of them, as well as a piece of themselves (true soul Syaoran!cest at it‘s finest)

I'm confused about this too but I'll try my hand at explaining what I think might possibly be the case..

This would be very out there, especially since a very dominant aspect of TRC is dreams and dream seeing.  Remember dreams are not merely dreams in this story, but they are their own world, and it seems the only place so far where two people who share the same soul are able to met (Piffle with Tomoyos)  Going along with this you could assume that Clow was speaking to R!Syaoran about Syaoran-kun back in Chapter 138 if  two people who share the same soul are only able to meet in a dream world.  Therefore R!Syaoran can only speak with and be with Syaoran-kun there.  If it was the case that R!Syaoran was helping out and keeping the “clone” inside of him then a dream would be a very easy path to the person who shares a soul.  R!Syaoran and “clone” can speak to each other outside the dream because they are not both “Syaorans”!  Syaoran-kun is a Syaoran <3

Another point that was in the Omake was how Mokona said that when Syaoran-kun slept he didn’t move and “it looked like he was sleeping  but….” , to which Yuuko just gave a sad smile.  Me thinks these “Syaoran” dreams (which may not even turn out to be dreams, because remember--even the dreams are another world) will play another part.  We see a small hint of it in the last arc with when R!Syaoran spoke in his sleep…which was eerily reminiscent of when “clone program” spoke through Syaoran-kun.

Also, we still need to clear up that if Syaoran-kun wasn’t a Syaoran then why would “clone program” be calling him so…?  Kurogane even bore witness. (Coincidental that he saw R!Syaoran sleep talking too…? =3)

Plus, R!Syaoran is one up on Cloney

That doesn’t mean he can become a clothing robber >.>
Also, so far, it’s fair to assume that Clow clothes=Syaoran-kun.  He’s even worn them when he was in a dream once…could this be his soul’s form…?

I've been pondering the whole tube thing recently and came up with a lot of questions like..

I don’t know…it seems she choose to go there but, as the story reflects, it was hitsuzen that she did end up there.  Also, what’s up with the wings?  I thought FWR was only after her body with the world memories?  But it looks like the wings are almost taking her back to her body and it’s like…she’s leaving Syaoran-kun there instead of the other way around.  Maybe because Syaoran-kun’s “heart” no longer has a body to go to so he‘s going vanish in the way Sakura‘s soul wouldn‘t have been able to last there either :/

I was wondering myself, if this is the dream world and the tube are the same then where is the tube part???  But if that picture is somewhat accurate I showed you awhile back then maybe Watanuki, Sakura, and R!Syaoran, (as well as Doumeki’s grandfather, I believe) have all appeared on one side in the long ends.  In xxxHolic it seemed at first Sakura was going into Watanuki’s dreams…with how there was that tree and all…?  But now that tree is gone and there’s only black (possibly the long tunnel of the tube) and this is why people are telling Watanuki to not go there, because he’s leaving his dream and being pulled into the tube instead :/

I don’t know what FWR wants with him exactly because when R!Syaoran woke up he’s like “Oh, he’s up.  That’s nice…let’s see what happens” If he didn’t want him up then couldn’t he have shown a little more care that someone he had trapped was escaping? >.< And if you’re going to let him go, why the hell are you tattooing him up and keeping him there in the first place? Everything seems to contradict itself nicely so good luck to CLAMP on that.

I wouldn't rely on the teasers on the splash

Oh, I wasn’t saying it was foreshadowing. I just said that was the thing that gave me the idea about Sakura and how she seems certain of getting Syaoran-kun’s heart.  I know for sure it’s the taglines (the sayings at the end of the chapter) that are written by the publishers though.

[ARGUMENT] If Syaoran-kun wasn’t destined to be TRC!Syaoran then why would CLAMP put him in their Wonderland?  Him and Hien are definitely with Sakura and other canon couples =3

But total LOL @ that poster.  The way Syaoran-kun is holding the reins to the scary dragon and she’s sitting all nice and they’re both smiling…it’s more like they’re riding a horse and carriage together xD  So adorable and so them!  I miss their smiles and their happiness! <3

*cough cough* You thought you had a long post…? I had to cut stuff out
…Don’t blame you if you don’t read all  xP

[redeternity]

I don’t think there’s much to do after Celes, much less time for more development.  CLAMP seems all plot, plot, plot now and we’ve had little time for thoughts and person >.<

Sorry because I'm replying to this when it wasn't directed at me but.. Just wanna say, I'm sure CLAMP will fit in character development for him somewhere (if not in Tsubasa, in xxxholic maybe?). Even if it is all plot, plot, plot right now they at least have to fit in his past at some point. Also, IF it is R!Syaoran in the tube, I think then we might get some character development. If it is him in there, I definately think he and Sakura will talk for a while first.
Even if it isn't him in the tube (better be grr.. makes me sad to think of it being Cloney in there. Me don't want ;_;) they just HAVE to fit in the development for him somewhere otherwise it would be pretty pointless having him in the manga in the first place.. Maybe after the whole tube scene happens.

If there’s any "merging" than I would say that it already took place and that was the merge of Syaoran-kun and his “clone program” (because, truly, that’s two pieces of a "soul")

Uh.. is it? I don't see how Cloney's programming makes up part of his soul.. Actually I would say the merging took place way back when R!Syaoran first gave his half heart away to the clone. In a sense, "Our Syaoran" is the result of R!Syaoran's half heart and Cloney's body merging.
I guess you could say that when R!Syaoran got his heart back in Acid Tokyo it was merging.. but I don't think so because it was his heart in the first place.

…that reminds me of something!  *goes off to get it for you*

The Syaorancest fanart? Found it yet?

[ARGUMENT] If Syaoran-kun wasn’t destined to be TRC!Syaoran then why would CLAMP put him in their Wonderland?

I would guess for the same reason that one of his eyes isn't blue, R!Syaoran is nowhere to be seen and Fai is not wearing an eyepatch - SPOILERS.

No, no.  What I was playing with was that R!Syaoran had been keeping the “clone program” in his body in hopes to give Syaoran-kun a chance to develop a heart of his own so that when the seal on his eye was broken his new heart wouldn’t allow him to be overpowered by the “clone program”

In which case we’d start getting into R!Syaoran puts half his heart and an eye in C!Syaoran, while he takes “half a heart” (clone program) and an eye.  So that the two really have a piece of each other inside of them, as well as a piece of themselves (true soul Syaoran!cest at it‘s finest)

R!Syaoran never took the "clone program" from Cloney.. If he did we'd know because when he got free from FWR's tube he'd be all "must... get... feathers". It was in Cloney the whole time but it was just less overpowering due to the fact that he had a half heart. If R!Syaoran had taken the "clone program" then why did FWR say about C!Syaoran that "as long as the determination to gather feathers remained that was all that mattered". Since FWR is second in line in power to Clow Reed I think he would have known if R!Syaoran had taken it.

Also, we still need to clear up that if Syaoran-kun wasn’t a Syaoran then why would “clone program” be calling him so…?

Cloney is a special case in TRC. He is not merely another world version of "Syaoran" - he was cl;oned and without a heart (at first until R!Syaoran intervened). Therefore he will never be a true "Syaoran" unless he can grow a heart that is exactly like that of the other Syaorans. I believe he was called Syaoran in his dreams because at that point he still had the half heart of R!Syaoran inside him (although I guess he should have really been called "half-Syaoran" xD but meh). Plus, it was what Fujitaka named him.. which goes back to the whole was it hitsuzen thing.. I still think that maybe if it wasn't hitsuzen then it might have been FWR of Clow who told Fujitaka beforehand to name him Syaoran.

Also, so far, it’s fair to assume that Clow clothes=Syaoran-kun.  He’s even worn them when he was in a dream once…could this be his soul’s form…?

I dunno. I'm not convinced yet. If those clothes are his soul's form then why is Sakura not wearing her princess' clothes in the dreamworld? If her princess' clothes don't represent her, then why would his Clow Clothes represent him?

Actually, to be frank, I think it's pointless talking about their clothing because at the moment it seems a bit random what they wear in their dreams. For example, in xxxholic when R!Syaoran appeared in the dream world in front of Watanuki he wore his Celes Clothing... well, that can't represent him surely? And he was also pictured on that splash with Watanuki wearing his FWR imprisonment outfit (again, same thing). And also, although C!Syaoran may have been in a dream with his Clow Clothes on once, he has also been in dreams wearing different outfits.

Speaking of clothes, I noticed that when they showed the stabbing that was supposed to happen with Fai and Syaoran they are wearing different clothes (not the Infinity ones or Tokyo ones). I wonder why? FWR says he’d planned it to happen to Syaoran “shortly after regaining his original power”.. eh? Original power? So I guess he doesn’t have his original power back yet then? Maybe that’s the thing he wants to get back? My guess is R!Syaoran was going to be stabbed at a later date in a different world but Sakura changed that by getting more powerful than Fai earlier (because from what I gathered I think that curse would only work once). Rarg, I really want to know more about R!Syaoran right now. *impatient*

just like right now it’s right that you assume that when he speaks of Sakura he’s talking of TRC!Sakura and her directly…

He definitely is talking about TRC Sakura in regards to the “protect” thing anyway, since he looked right at her.

Oh, I wasn’t saying it was foreshadowing. I just said that was the thing that gave me the idea about Sakura and how she seems certain of getting Syaoran-kun’s heart.

I do wonder whether she still wants to return the heart like she said she did back in Acid Tokyo. Since she said that she’s had all the premonitions and whatnot and could well have changed her mind. And hopefully she’s realised by now the heart belongs to R!Syaoran not Cloney. I really hope she has realised this *crosses fingers* because if she still has her mind set on “returning” the heart I think she’s wasting her time – sorry! Plus, if she did somehow manage to do it (IMO I think she can’t due to what R!Syaoran said) that’s so horrible for R!Syaoran ;_; Even if she doesn’t have feelings for him, she definitely cares for him.

PS. Sorry this post was very rushed, I apologise for any mistakes. I am going away for a few days (nowhere exciting though). You probably won’t even notice I’m gone but I thought I'd let you know because I will take a couple of days longer to reply than I do usually.

[Mari]

Arg.  Sorry for the late reply >.< Putting together 1000 packets is brain damaging time consuming.

it would be pretty pointless having him in the manga in the first place

*laughs* That’s definitely what is has been feeling like for the past 3 Volumes

merging.

Where did this whole merge thing start out anyways?  Me thinks because of the Teaser

I would guess for the same reason that one of his eyes isn't blue, R!Syaoran is nowhere to be seen and Fai is not wearing an eyepatch - SPOILERS.

LoL. So quick to defend you miss the point of my argument.  I mean, if Syoaran-kun was meant to perish then why would they put him in something as a representation of what TRC is?  This isn’t like a poster that they change every month, this is their showcase for years.  Besides, it’s been a year now and R!Syaoran has nothing to back his importance/existence in this series.

R!Syaoran never took the "clone program" from Cloney.. If he did we'd know because when he got free from FWR's tube he'd be all "must... get... feathers". It was in Cloney the whole time but it was just less overpowering due to the fact that he had a half heart. If R!Syaoran had taken the "clone program" then why did FWR say about C!Syaoran that "as long as the determination to gather feathers remained that was all that mattered".

Not necessarily.  Because R!Syaoran has his own heart so he wouldn’t be over powered by stuff like that. Also, it was after C!Syaoran had already been with Syaoran-kun so he already left :p  But, like I was saying, I was just playing with the idea to understand why C!Syaoran looked like R!Syaoran.  Not really supporting it but just throwing it out there to make myself look stupid once we know what’s really happening And the “determination to gather feathers remained” was still there without “program” because of Syaoran-kun’s will, just in a different sense xP

I still think that maybe if it wasn't hitsuzen then it might have been FWR of Clow who told Fujitaka beforehand to name him Syaoran.

Ahaha.  You just supported my argument. xDD
And it would still be Hitsuzen even if, though I highly doubt, a FWR of Clow had told him.  Everything is!

I dunno. I'm not convinced yet. If those clothes are his soul's form then why is Sakura not wearing her princess' clothes in the dreamworld? If her princess' clothes don't represent her, then why would his Clow Clothes represent him?

I was going to respond to this but my answer would be similar to my post a few back, as was yours right now.  LoL.  We’ve finally reached the point of repetition.  Yay…?

And also, although C!Syaoran may have been in a dream with his Clow Clothes on once, he has also been in dreams wearing different outfits.

The time he wore his Clow clothes was the first time “clone” was able to touch him though, which was why it struck me.  But yea.  Enough with clothes… O.o

Speaking of clothes, I noticed that when they showed the stabbing that was supposed to happen

NM.  Back to clothes…
I don’t think it was to happen in a different world because Sakura said herself that “the thing I saw in the dream will take place in this final battle” And I thought he did have it back, but because Sakura went for the feathers she became even stronger.

He definitely is talking about TRC Sakura in regards to the “protect” thing anyway, since he looked right at her.

I mean it’s in what sense that you’re completing the sentence.

I do wonder...

Sakura is defiantly still identifying the two as different because back before the battle she says that “I traveled with someone who shares an appearance with you” and she is also still referring to them differently to Watanuki.  We still don’t know what it actually means to have half of R!Syaoran in Syaoran-kun anyways.  Because Eriol and Fujitaka-san were two pieces of Clow but they were certainly different beings.

Kk.  Have fun! ^.^ 

[PS] I see you finally got yourself a banner!! <3

[redeternity]

*laughs* That’s definitely what is has been feeling like for the past 3 Volumes

Lol! So harsh! Poor R!Syao! I love him anyways xD
Keep in mind, though, C!Syaoran got a whole 15 volumes to himself. R!Syaoran only made his entrance in volume 16, giving him only about 5 volumes so far - one of which has been entirely focused on Fai's past (so really about 4 volumes then). PLUS, unlike the 15 vols when C!Syaoran was the main character, the focus hasn't been on R!Syaoran during much of the time he's been around (e.g. Infinity World - focus on Sakura; Celes - focus on Fai/Ashura). Also, ever since he appeared all the TRC gang (except Kuro maybe) have been angsting (not only Syaoran) so he hasn't had much of a chance to show his true self yet. Had Fai been angsting from the very beginning nobody probably would have liked him either.
Anyway, I've said this a thousand times already but Fai's. past. over. now. plzkthnx. One or two more chapters hopefully?

I mean, if Syoaran-kun was meant to perish then why would they put him in something as a representation of what TRC is?  This isn’t like a poster that they change every month, this is their showcase for years.

C!Syaoran represents TRC because he's the main character and has been around 15 vols (whereas R!Syaoran has only been around 5).
...Besides, he has R!Syaoran's heart in him so technically it's actually R!Syaoran in CLAMP's wonderland (bwahaha! xD)

And about the perishing thing - killing off the main character is not something that CLAMP would definately not do, right?

And the “determination to gather feathers remained” was still there without “program” because of Syaoran-kun’s will, just in a different sense xP

If by "Syaoran-kun's will" you mean because he loved Sakura and wanted to get the feathers for her sake.. Well, C!Syaoran hadn't even met Sakura yet so how would FWR have known that he'd grow to love her and that would be his impetus to gather feathers? Even Eriol in CCS could not have predicted that Syaoran and Sakura would fall in love.

I was going to respond to this but my answer would be similar to my post a few back, as was yours right now.  LoL.  We’ve finally reached the point of repetition.  Yay…?

Whoops o.O Had I said that already? Heh, sorry. My bad!

NM.  Back to clothes…
I don’t think it was to happen in a different world because Sakura said herself that “the thing I saw in the dream will take place in this final battle” And I thought he did have it back, but because Sakura went for the feathers she became even stronger.

But when she said that and we saw the fragments of the future that she saw, it showed Syaoran and Kurogane looking shocked and a bit of her bellybutton with blood around her. So it must have been herself she saw getting stabbed.

We still don’t know what it actually means to have half of R!Syaoran in Syaoran-kun anyways.  Because Eriol and Fujitaka-san were two pieces of Clow but they were certainly different beings.

They were reincarnations. Which is slightly different I think. R!Syaoran did not die to give away his half heart.

And yea! I did make myself a banner hehe and I didn't use paint!

Anyway, spoilers came out today. Looks like Syaoran got up from the floor *gasp* xD
Oh, and the Horitsuba comic! - I think there are translations out but I haven't read them yet but looking at the pictures I'm sure Syaoran's twin (R!Syaoran?) is the non-blushing, more serious (but smiling) one <3 <3
Seeing them together, he looks much more mature for some reason.. the eyes I think.
EDIT: Read it =D Lmao at the bath part!!